hachyderm.io is one of the many independent Mastodon servers you can use to participate in the fediverse.
Hachyderm is a safe space, LGBTQIA+ and BLM, primarily comprised of tech industry professionals world wide. Note that many non-user account types have restrictions - please see our About page.

Administered by:

Server stats:

9.4K
active users

Periodic reminder of the Native American approach to minimizing the power of forest fires.

They say the California forests are not "natural." They were planted by humans, 10,000 to 20,000 years ago.

They learned that if you don't do controlled burns, that in
~100 years, you get fire tornadoes.😬

m.youtube.com/watch?v=Mby72d2V

It's difficult for many US people to accept that native Americans planted entire forests. They seem too big.

But just in the past 20 years, we've seen multiple examples in many countries, of one individual human creating entire forests. In India. Brazil. Indonesia. China. Etc.

Like this dude:

youtube.com/shorts/APL35AVtWqM

The Karuk tribe says, "Making forests is easy! Just plant a few trees every day for a few years. But some years are drier, hotter, and windier. You can't let fuel build up. If you don't do controlled burns, then 1 year within about 100, you will pay a terrible price. The sky will turn red."

Indigenous people learned this the hard way when they were starting out planting forests. They said that the biggest fires crossed entire rivers by raining burning embers for miles, and "created their own weather of wind and lightning." Entire villages disappeared.

Of course we didn't believe them.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=q92H5PHs

I guess what I'm saying is, all those feel good videos of people planting entire forests in Brazil and India and China and Mexico etc, are probably making the same mistake that indigenous people in those same places made *checks notes* 20,000 years ago, before they figured it out.

Yes, we do some burns. No, we don't do enough. There's still too much fuel.

And we stopped burns for the better part of the past 100 years. We started limited burns again in large part due to the advocacy of people like Dr. Frank Lake, a Karuk person who also has a PhD in Environmental Sciences.👍🏿

research.fs.usda.gov/about/peo

To put it in perspective, in 2023, California treated 700,000 acres. That's a lot! But California has ~33 million acres of forest.🤯

For much of the past 20,000 years, many parts of that 33 million acres were treated regularly. Then for the most recent 100 years, they were mostly not treated at all.

gov.ca.gov/2025/01/08/californ

m.youtube.com- YouTubeEnjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.
cliffle

@mekkaokereke there's also increasing evidence (I don't have the study at hand, but I could probably track it down if you haven't seen it) that regions with high "natural" biodiversity in the Amazon are actually heavily cultivated areas, maintained over thousands and thousands of years by the folks living there.

(Who, incidentally, have been saying that the whole time.)

The forests just don't look like European-style row crops, so we don't see them.

@cliffle @mekkaokereke this is the central thesis of Seeing Like A State. Strongly recommended.

@cliffle @mekkaokereke

I'm pretty sure I've heard of this too, in a slightly different form -- I've seen a claim that there are patches of the Amazon that have anomalously high densities of human-edible plants, which are thought to be a botanical remnant of prior cultivation.

I've never actually run it down for critical assessment.

Edit to add, might be this one (Nature paywall, but abstract is readable):

nature.com/articles/s41477-018

NatureThe legacy of 4,500 years of polyculture agroforestry in the eastern Amazon - Nature PlantsFossil records suggest that the Amazon rainforest in the pre-Columbian era was home to polyculture agroforestry, with multiple annual crops providing subsistence for indigenous groups who shaped the Amazon as early as 4,500 years ago.

@cliffle @mekkaokereke

They made biochar. That's the only reason there is anything edible in the Amazon. The ancient people engineered it.

@cliffle @mekkaokereke this is interesting. I wonder whether it is easy to model mathematically. Maybe I should write a paper about it... 🤔