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This Recall thing is a prime example of how bad we are at understanding when something is a systemic problem.

It doesn't matter if *you* disable it. It doesn't matter if *you* install Linux. It doesn't matter if *you* set your computer on fire and move to a Luddite commune.

If you have *ever* sent sensitive data, no matter how securely, to another person who now has this shit enabled, and they find your data and look at it, your data is compromised, and there's nothing you can do about it.

In response to a frequent observation / complaint:

Yes, it has always been possible for individuals to leak your data in various ways. The difference here is in *scale* and *uniformity*.

This is a tool being rolled out to the most widely used desktop operating system, as a trusted operating system component, which will be enabled by default, and will save its data to a single standardised location which attackers can trivially target.

If you don't see the issue, I don't know what to tell you.

In response to another criticism, yes, my phrasing is imprecise. It matters to some extent whether you take precautions to secure your own computer -- doing so will reduce your level of risk, and you should do it. But you cannot assume that if you do this you will be completely protected. We live in a society, and that means that we have already given out a lot of personal data which is now stored in conditions which are about to become a lot less secure.

Adrianna Pińska

"But if everyone just installed Linux..." "But everyone *should*..." But they won't. They absolutely won't, for the same reason that everyone won't "just" do literally anything else in history that would immediately fix everything if everyone "just" did it. No matter how much you reason, beg, cajole, or threaten. So that *cannot be the plan*.

I don't have a magic solution to suggest. I believe that this problem can only be solved by a massive backlash at an institutional level. You have to punch them right in the money. So if you have any influence at all in an institution that uses MS products, this is probably the time to raise concerns, loudly, with citations.

@confluency it would even be fine if everyone *just turned recall off*

@dystopia It would! But they still won't! :blobfoxteaowo:

(Also, as long as it's there, an attacker can probably turn it back on -- apparently it's easy to do that and to obfuscate it.)

@confluency @dystopia Microsoft will probably turn it back on during an update, same as they keep pushing Bing, OneDrive (for backup!) and so on.

@rogerlipscombe @confluency @dystopia
Good luck getting big business to switch off Windows...

Take it from someone who was a Windows admin for a decade, the users and C-Suite would revolt if anything was moved out of place.

Theses people need their icons to be in the right place, what would make anyone think they could tolerate a different operating system?

@confluency sadly this is all true. Maybe it’s time for me to try Linux again

@confluency the "just install linux crowd" are so infuriating. I "just installed" it a few weeks ago, and had to spend at least 30 hours tweaking shit to get a "normal" and usable experience, and there's no way I could have done any of that in the amount of time that I did, without being a huge nerd that used to use Linux full time over a decade ago. It's not viable unless you're someone steeped in this stuff, which most people aren't, and don't have time to be.

@fancysandwiches I've exclusively used Linux for two decades -- I'm reluctant to call myself an "expert" on anything, but I'm certainly an experienced user, and as a software developer and general nerd I'm comfortable debugging userspace Linux issues. And *I* experience at least a few hours of frustration every time I upgrade to the next LTS and five little things break in unexpected ways and I have to tweak them.

@fancysandwiches I think Linux would meet a lot of people's needs, but it really annoys me when it's promoted as a trivial drop-in replacement, because it clearly isn't. You need to have the time, willingness, and inclination to learn it (and potentially solve some problems), and to continue to maintain it in the future. The first part is the easiest to solve, but you can't *make* people learn and use a skill they're not interested in.

@fancysandwiches And I say that as someone who thinks that more people *should* learn basic programming and automation instead of using their computer like an appliance. I have a whole speech about how it's like learning to drive, and everything. But you can't make people do anything! That's not how people work!

@confluency @fancysandwiches @patterfloof And even if you don't have this issue, all it takes is 1 bit of software. My travel laptop runs mint. But if I need to do accounts on it, I need to RDP into a windows machine, because my accounts software doesn't run on linux. It's the package that can therefore break anything I want to migrate.

@confluency @fancysandwiches I've found the Ubuntu LTS upgrade experience to he mostly seamless for years now.

@confluency
I made a Linux T-shirt once that said:

I'm Smart
And I use Linux
(Draw Your Own Conclusions)

@confluency
Not to mention, for Rocky Horror fans:

Don't Dream It
Apt-get It